Bad Manners and Brimstone

I am curious how this forum would handle the following.
 
Bob wants to take a vacation with his wife and young small children. He would like to invite his parents and his sibling Emily. However, he does not want to invite his only other sibling Shelly and her husband.
 
Shelly’s kids are all grown. If invited, she would likely decline because what money and time that she has available goes towards keeping up with her kids. But this a guess and she could very well accept, too. However, the real problem lies with Shelly’s husband Sam. He is considered a “small doses” kind of person for most of the family. They have never been to restaurant with him when he didn’t make a fuss over how something was wrong with the food (even when no one else saw issue.) He gets grumpy if the plans are not catered to his desires and needs. And he does not seem particularly fond over doing kids activities (something that this vacation would focus on.) Nothing ever seems to make him happy and he seems to be in a constant state of grump. Including Shelly and Sam has the potential of really downing the vacation. However, they are also the sort of people to get vocally offended if they are not invited to something and there is great potential for real hurt to be caused by not inviting them.

Emily is single with no kids; she does not need to worry about saving money or time for her own children. She also loves kids and is pretty agreeable to travel with (or at least, Bob does not sense conflicts in the ways that she travels and the way she rolls with the punches.) The bonus is that she is able to act as an additional adult and help care for the children; something that she would not only enjoy, but would not complain about. (Maybe noteworthy, Emily has vacationed with Shelly and her kids when they were little and prior to marrying Sam. When Sam entered the family, the invitations stopped. Shelly never invited Bob and he appears to have always been fine with that.)
 
If Bob does not invite Shelly and Sam, he fears that they will cause all kinds of family chaos. Not to mention that the lack of invitation is hurtful.
 
If Bob invites them, he fears that this whole vacation will unbearable. (Or they may decline the invitation... not sure of what level of fuss that they would make, though.)
 
Bob could also not invite Emily, but he does want her there. But that would be an easy fix to the problem (even if the outcome is not what Bob wants.)

Maybe there is another option?

What would you tell Bob?

Personally, if it were me I would let Shelly and Sam know about the vacation but be VERY SPECIFIC about the kind of vacation it is (i.e heavy focus on the kids stuff) and just hope they decide not to join.  My advice is from the perspective of someone who is the family peace keeper.   

Just as an aside....it wasn't really clear from the OP but I would be careful about having this be a 100% kids focused vacation. It sounds like there are five adults currently planning on going. I don't know how old the kids are, but presumably young and probably with a bedtime around 8:00 p.m. It is not reasonable to expect that the adults who are not their parents will not want to do some of their own things during this vacation. I often hear of people in similar situations having each "group" take a night for child care so the others can go do something "adult."

Anyone else imagining Debbie Downer in the (in)famous Disneyworld skit?

I was not familiar with it, but this is too funny!!! (And yes, reminds me a bit like Sam.) I love that the cast can't even keep a straight face!

Just as an aside....it wasn't really clear from the OP but I would be careful about having this be a 100% kids focused vacation. It sounds like there are five adults currently planning on going. I don't know how old the kids are, but presumably young and probably with a bedtime around 8:00 p.m. It is not reasonable to expect that the adults who are not their parents will not want to do some of their own things during this vacation. I often hear of people in similar situations having each "group" take a night for child care so the others can go do something "adult."

Great aside! I know that Bob and wife are planning to go out separate one evening (one of the reasons why they are bringing along other adults.) I am not sure if the other adults will have an evening to do the same, but knowing Bob, he would certainly allow for this. I think it's wise for any trip with a bigger group that there be some flexibility to break away... otherwise you can get on each others' nerves.

Quote from: DaDancingPsych on September 20, 2019, 10:32:16 am

Great aside! I know that Bob and wife are planning to go out separate one evening (one of the reasons why they are bringing along other adults.) I am not sure if the other adults will have an evening to do the same, but knowing Bob, he would certainly allow for this. I think it's wise for any trip with a bigger group that there be some flexibility to break away... otherwise you can get on each others' nerves.

If I were a non-parent of small kids going on this trip I would not seek "permission" from Bob to do anything! Unless Bob is paying for the trip or paying the other adults to provide childcare, the other adults can and should be able to do whatever they want to whenever they want to without having to provide childcare unless they want to!

If Bob is actually paying for the trip that might change things a little....but it would never occur to me that I would have to babysit someone else's kids on vacation all the time so THE ACTUAL PARENTS could go out alone but I could not.

I am sorry if I painted Bob in the wrong light. He is not the type to hold other adults hostage or anything. Sure, he is hoping that extra adult eyes will help keep his young children safe, but he is certainly not the type to throw his parenting responsibilities out the window. I think that the idea of the other adults getting their own adult time has not be discussed because Bob ASSUMES that they will do their own thing whenever they like. (Bob and wife going out was discussed, because they know that they cannot assume that they can leave their kids and someone will instantly care for them.) It really is a thoughtful aside, but my assessment of Bob is that while he wants a nice kid-friendly vacation for his children and would like to include these other people that he would never demand anything from anyone.

I read "allow for"  as in planning on it within the schedule, not giving permission.

To me it came across as Bob somehow believing Bob would be the one (and the only one) to set the schedule. I don’t know that that is a great or viable plan (unless Bob is paying for everyone’s vacation).

I appreciate DaDancingPsych’s explanation. If it were me, though, I would assume I could do whatever I wanted to do unless I specifically agreed to watch the kids for Bob and his wife. I would be making my own additions to or deviations from the schedule based on what I wanted to do (which may or may not be kid friendly).

can they cast it as "Emily is coming along to babysit"?

Even if she doesn't really?