Author Topic: Remember the "Young Lady" discussion? I learned a brilliant approach today  (Read 1145 times)

Rose Red

I'm not a fan of being called "my friend" by a near stranger. I'd rather be called by name or nothing at all. But I won't get offended or annoyed if I know their intentions are good.
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lowspark

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I just don't think that there is a one-size-fits-all way to address people. No matter which way you go, some will like it and some won't.

I don't mind being called ma'am by someone who is a stranger and is using that form of address to indicate respect for me as a customer or the like. I don't like being called ma'am by a colleague, i.e., someone whom I consider to be at the same level in a business sense.

The waitress at the diner calling me "sugar" or "hon" I take with a grain of salt. I live in a culture where that's just normal and nothing is really meant by it.

Going to the doctor's office and the staff calling me "friend" would be odd. I'm not her friend, I'm her patient/customer/client.

No matter what though, the only time I comment on someone addressing me is if they mispronounce (or really misread) my name, which actually happens quite often since I have a somewhat unusual name that, if you add a letter in the middle of it, is a very common name.

gellchom

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I don't want to give the impression that I don't like "ma'am" or that I prefer "my friend." 

I just thought that "my friend" was a good choice when the person isn't in a position to know (or remember at that moment) the other person's name, but "ma'am" isn't the right choice for some reason (like, you've already said it three times) or the person is looking for a more familiar approach, in an appropriate setting.

It is interesting to learn that in the UK no one says anything!  They just get to the point.

I'm surprised that anyone finds "my friend" in a context like this (it was a nurse giving me a COVID-19 test, in my case) to be overly familiar.  To me, it just hits my ear as a general positive all-purpose term, like "Dear ____," "Sincerely," and "Yours truly" in letters -- not meant literally, just as a conventional pleasantry.  Some people even use "Neighbor."  I've often heard people giving speeches addressing the audience as "My friends."

I thought it was terrific when once in Uganda a young man working at a restaurant called me "Mother."  What could be more familiar than that?  But it felt super respectful.

PVZFan

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I also prefer it when I'm starting a morning meeting and "Ladies and Gentleman" feels gender biased. I'll say, or "Welcome friends" or "Honored Guests" or "Distinguished Guests."

I think different people just naturally prefer different things. I don't like false intimacy, personally, whether giving or receiving, so I would never say "Welcome friends" and while it doesn't offend me it doesn't make me feel "warm and fuzzy" either. I think it more just makes me think "that's kinda weird" if said by someone who does not even know me.

When I do presentations or run meetings I typically start with, "Good morning! Thank you for being here. Our first topic....." The more I think about this the more certain I am that I avoid using terms like sir, ma'am, friend, etc in general! I also ask people to address me by my first name because I don't like to be referred to as Mrs. My Husband's name or Ms. My Maiden/Professional name. I am a lawyer and it makes me CRAZY to call another lawyer and have his or her assistant say, "Attorney Smith is not in." Do they seriously refer to their coworker, even if that coworker is their boss, as Attorney Smith?!?!?

The bolded seems a little abrupt to me. When I'm starting a training or large group meeting, I start with the "Welcome," then move to the housekeeping things ("if you haven't taken advantage of hospitality, feel free to do so as we begin, restrooms are X, etc. etc.) then I move to a little warm-up like "What do you hope to get out of today?" or an ice breaker. Sometimes I tell a joke.

I don't want to give the impression that I don't like "ma'am" or that I prefer "my friend." 

I just thought that "my friend" was a good choice when the person isn't in a position to know (or remember at that moment) the other person's name, but "ma'am" isn't the right choice for some reason (like, you've already said it three times) or the person is looking for a more familiar approach, in an appropriate setting.

It is interesting to learn that in the UK no one says anything!  They just get to the point.

I'm surprised that anyone finds "my friend" in a context like this (it was a nurse giving me a COVID-19 test, in my case) to be overly familiar.  To me, it just hits my ear as a general positive all-purpose term, like "Dear ____," "Sincerely," and "Yours truly" in letters -- not meant literally, just as a conventional pleasantry.  Some people even use "Neighbor."  I've often heard people giving speeches addressing the audience as "My friends."

I thought it was terrific when once in Uganda a young man working at a restaurant called me "Mother."  What could be more familiar than that?  But it felt super respectful.

I've had young people call me Auntie. I'm with you, it felt super respectful and warm. if I think about it, it feels overly familiar and like a bad idea, but when I receive it, it lands really well.
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gellchom

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I also prefer it when I'm starting a morning meeting and "Ladies and Gentleman" feels gender biased. I'll say, or "Welcome friends" or "Honored Guests" or "Distinguished Guests."

I think different people just naturally prefer different things. I don't like false intimacy, personally, whether giving or receiving, so I would never say "Welcome friends" and while it doesn't offend me it doesn't make me feel "warm and fuzzy" either. I think it more just makes me think "that's kinda weird" if said by someone who does not even know me.

When I do presentations or run meetings I typically start with, "Good morning! Thank you for being here. Our first topic....." The more I think about this the more certain I am that I avoid using terms like sir, ma'am, friend, etc in general! I also ask people to address me by my first name because I don't like to be referred to as Mrs. My Husband's name or Ms. My Maiden/Professional name. I am a lawyer and it makes me CRAZY to call another lawyer and have his or her assistant say, "Attorney Smith is not in." Do they seriously refer to their coworker, even if that coworker is their boss, as Attorney Smith?!?!?

The bolded seems a little abrupt to me. When I'm starting a training or large group meeting, I start with the "Welcome," then move to the housekeeping things ("if you haven't taken advantage of hospitality, feel free to do so as we begin, restrooms are X, etc. etc.) then I move to a little warm-up like "What do you hope to get out of today?" or an ice breaker. Sometimes I tell a joke.

I don't want to give the impression that I don't like "ma'am" or that I prefer "my friend." 

I just thought that "my friend" was a good choice when the person isn't in a position to know (or remember at that moment) the other person's name, but "ma'am" isn't the right choice for some reason (like, you've already said it three times) or the person is looking for a more familiar approach, in an appropriate setting.

It is interesting to learn that in the UK no one says anything!  They just get to the point.

I'm surprised that anyone finds "my friend" in a context like this (it was a nurse giving me a COVID-19 test, in my case) to be overly familiar.  To me, it just hits my ear as a general positive all-purpose term, like "Dear ____," "Sincerely," and "Yours truly" in letters -- not meant literally, just as a conventional pleasantry.  Some people even use "Neighbor."  I've often heard people giving speeches addressing the audience as "My friends."

I thought it was terrific when once in Uganda a young man working at a restaurant called me "Mother."  What could be more familiar than that?  But it felt super respectful.

I've had young people call me Auntie. I'm with you, it felt super respectful and warm. if I think about it, it feels overly familiar and like a bad idea, but when I receive it, it lands really well.

I suppose it depends upon the overall respect for elders in the culture.  Which makes it pretty sad if it's not considered respectful!

Jem

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I also prefer it when I'm starting a morning meeting and "Ladies and Gentleman" feels gender biased. I'll say, or "Welcome friends" or "Honored Guests" or "Distinguished Guests."

I think different people just naturally prefer different things. I don't like false intimacy, personally, whether giving or receiving, so I would never say "Welcome friends" and while it doesn't offend me it doesn't make me feel "warm and fuzzy" either. I think it more just makes me think "that's kinda weird" if said by someone who does not even know me.

When I do presentations or run meetings I typically start with, "Good morning! Thank you for being here. Our first topic....." The more I think about this the more certain I am that I avoid using terms like sir, ma'am, friend, etc in general! I also ask people to address me by my first name because I don't like to be referred to as Mrs. My Husband's name or Ms. My Maiden/Professional name. I am a lawyer and it makes me CRAZY to call another lawyer and have his or her assistant say, "Attorney Smith is not in." Do they seriously refer to their coworker, even if that coworker is their boss, as Attorney Smith?!?!?

The bolded seems a little abrupt to me. When I'm starting a training or large group meeting, I start with the "Welcome," then move to the housekeeping things ("if you haven't taken advantage of hospitality, feel free to do so as we begin, restrooms are X, etc. etc.) then I move to a little warm-up like "What do you hope to get out of today?" or an ice breaker. Sometimes I tell a joke.


I should clarify that someone else generally introduces me and has done those housekeeping things. I am more of a keynote or main speaker. My point is that I don't say, "Welcome, Friends!" or "Ladies and Gentlemen!"

BrownEyedGirl

I work at the front desk at my office. I've worked there for quite a while, so I recognize many of our clients by sight.  The ones I don't recognize--if they're new enough that I might not remember them yet, or if they haven't been in for a while--I greet by saying "Hello there, how can I help you?"  It's familiar enough and yet still professional, so it seems to be a good balance.
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PVZFan

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I should clarify that someone else generally introduces me and has done those housekeeping things. I am more of a keynote or main speaker. My point is that I don't say, "Welcome, Friends!" or "Ladies and Gentlemen!"

I'm envious! Even when I'm presenting for the entire day, I have to do my own introductions and warm-up.

Nikko-chan

"my friend" is a very good gender neutral alternative i think.

Rose Red

This is going to sound petty, but I prefer "friend" rather than "my friend."

I'm not sure why the "my" bothers me a bit, but like I said before, I wouldn't make a but deal out of it.

Aleko

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This is going to sound petty, but I prefer "friend" rather than "my friend."

I'm not sure why the "my" bothers me a bit, but like I said before, I wouldn't make a but deal out of it.

Unless it was very clearly part of the normal dialect of the person using it (like being called 'pet' in Newcastle, or 'luv' in Yorkshire), I'd cringe or bridle inside at either.

lisastitch

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This is going to sound petty, but I prefer "friend" rather than "my friend."

I'm not sure why the "my" bothers me a bit, but like I said before, I wouldn't make a but deal out of it.

I was going to comment on this, too.  I'm not bothered by it when addressing a group, but when it's used by one person to one other person, "my friend" feels a little too intimate.  Not that I would make anything out of it--more an internal "My friend?  You don't know the first thing about me."

SecretSauce

When I was in college back in the late 80s/early 90s (in the US) the ladies that worked in the cafeteria were all older African American women who had been with the school for many years.  Several of them would address the students as "baby" in a respectful manner.  Never occurred to me that it was anything else.

Years later I was taking the bus home from work and had transferred from the metro train to the bus.  The machine that you could get a transfer chit from was out of paper.  When boarded the bus I asked the African American driver how much it was (as I was used to paying a quarter with my transfer) due to the issue with the transfer machine.  He said "Don't worry about it Baby."  I thanked him and dropped my quarter in.

Bottom line I always consider the source before I get offended about things.

Jem

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Bottom line I always consider the source before I get offended about things.

I am not easily offended and don't look for ways to be offended either. I might not prefer to be called certain things, but I am not going to let it ruin my day nor am I likely to "call someone out" when I assume they mean well, even if to me they are misguided.

I 100% agree with your approach and I try to put the best construction on everything. That said, I don't know that all people extend that same courtesy and it makes me sad. I also bristle at the idea of "it's okay for Beth to say it because she is [physical attribute]," but "it's not okay for Sue to say the same thing because she is not [physical attribute]."
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oogyda

Would it matter at all knowing the term "Friend" is what those of a particular Christian denomination refer to themselves and other in the same church as?