Bad Manners and Brimstone

Quote from: DaDancingPsych on August 22, 2020, 08:19:25 am

<SNIP>

Quote from: jpcher on August 21, 2020, 03:29:54 pm

As a graphic designer I can't tell you how many times people come to me and ask me to use this specific photo. I immediately ask them where the photo originated from. Their response "Oh, I got it off the internet." Nope, nope, nope, not going to happen. Unless they can show me the site the photo came from and prove that it's in public domain I'm not going to go down for copyright infringement.

To be clear, I completely agree (and probably the law supports) what you are saying jpcher! If the situation is a professional setting and the photo is to be used on the website, company letter, or even the company Facebook page, you best gain permission, give credit to the photographer, and potentially pay for its usage. This even goes if a company employee (non-professional photographer) snaps a photo at the company party with their personal smart phone. (I am sure that there is a way to assign an employee to take photographs that instantly become company property, but I would still think it appropriate to credit that person.)

However, my sense of the LW's situation is not a professional company. People are reposting and swiping pictures for their personal use and likely not profiting from them in any shape or form. In a strict etiquette sense, yes, these family members should be asking Cousin LW to "share" the photo on their own Facebook page. But the etiquette norms (at least in my circle of Facebook friends) is that it's really not necessary. If I post a picture of my bestie Ellen, I have no problem if she puts it on her wall, downloads it and emails it to her mom, or if she prints it to be framed in her living room. I don't think that when she's doing this that she is taking credit for the photo. Now if she sent it in for a photo contest, then I might have an issue!

Now I will say that I belong to a few Facebook groups where there are rules in place that you can't share people's posts (which includes photos) with those outside of the group. I get why this rule is in place. And since it is an established rule by the admin, I think we all need to abide by it. If I don't like it, I can leave the group.

I don't want to muddy the discussion, but I have a loose understanding that when I post pictures to Facebook (and likely other Internet sites) that my photo actually becomes property of Facebook. I wonder how that could change things.

This is an interesting topic! Thank you Hmmm for posting!!!

True. I posted as a professional with strong ethics.

True. This was/is a family gathering and photos were shared with attendees who then went on to share the photos with other friends via internet (Facebook or whatever).

True. Those photos are now out there in the cloud somewhere where anybody can pick them up and use them for whatever purpose they'd like. Without consent or credit to the photographer.

True. I'm not arguing with anybody here, I mostly agree with your posts about personal photos. However I do think that LW is not high maintenance and anyone that publishes photos on-line should seriously think about watermarking or signing their photos.

Who knows? Maybe one of your photos would be worth big bucks but you don't get credit (or money) for it.

I got the impression they were already accessible "out there" since the relatives were able to download to a phone or post on their FB pages.

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Quote from: Jem on August 25, 2020, 08:19:05 am

We had a woman at my church who used to come to fellowship events and announce that she would use her fancy camera to take photos of everyone. But then she NEVER SHARED THE PHOTOS WITH ANYONE. This happened multiple times. I still think it is extremely weird. What on earth did she do with them?!?! At any rate, the first event I was at where she did this I didn't take many photos of my own because I assumed she was taking photos OF THE EVENT to be SHARED WITH PEOPLE AT THE EVENT about the event. When I (and others) learned that she was NOT sharing these photos we basically started just ignoring her photo taking at future events.

Maybe she just wanted some memories for herself of good friends enjoying an event? I mean, before social media and the whole photo-sharing phenomenon, isn't that what people did when they took pictures?

Sure. But Jem's point was that she appeared to be implying that she was going to take a string of lovely photos for everyone to share, but it turned out she wasn't. It's quite possible of course that Jem misunderstood her and that she actually only meant to alert the company that because she had such a great camera she was going to be leaping around seeking the best angles for a shot, et cetera, and (just possibly) to give people a chance to say if they didn't want to be in any of her pictures, or conversely ask her for them if they wanted to see them.   YMMV, but if I see someone snapping away with their own camera at an event I don't automatically assume they're going to share their photos, unless they say so.

Quote from: Jem on August 25, 2020, 08:19:05 am

We had a woman at my church who used to come to fellowship events and announce that she would use her fancy camera to take photos of everyone. But then she NEVER SHARED THE PHOTOS WITH ANYONE. This happened multiple times. I still think it is extremely weird. What on earth did she do with them?!?! At any rate, the first event I was at where she did this I didn't take many photos of my own because I assumed she was taking photos OF THE EVENT to be SHARED WITH PEOPLE AT THE EVENT about the event. When I (and others) learned that she was NOT sharing these photos we basically started just ignoring her photo taking at future events.

I do find this odd, but I could see a scenario where the woman says something like, "I attend many of my church's fellowship events and I always tell everyone that I will be taking photos. However, would you believe that no one ever asks to see or use them?!?" Maybe she doesn't want to be pushy and force her photos on people? If not already attempted, I might ask her about them. "How did your luncheon photos turn out? Is there a way that I could view them?" I think that would be quite telling.

I guess I never discussed this with her directly, but the church has an online presence where photos of events are posted, and sometimes even has printed out photos to be pinned to a bulletin board. She knows that the church asks for photos people have taken to be shared with others - but she doesn't.

Quote from: DaDancingPsych on August 26, 2020, 07:26:35 am

Quote from: Jem on August 25, 2020, 08:19:05 am

We had a woman at my church who used to come to fellowship events and announce that she would use her fancy camera to take photos of everyone. But then she NEVER SHARED THE PHOTOS WITH ANYONE. This happened multiple times. I still think it is extremely weird. What on earth did she do with them?!?! At any rate, the first event I was at where she did this I didn't take many photos of my own because I assumed she was taking photos OF THE EVENT to be SHARED WITH PEOPLE AT THE EVENT about the event. When I (and others) learned that she was NOT sharing these photos we basically started just ignoring her photo taking at future events.

I do find this odd, but I could see a scenario where the woman says something like, "I attend many of my church's fellowship events and I always tell everyone that I will be taking photos. However, would you believe that no one ever asks to see or use them?!?" Maybe she doesn't want to be pushy and force her photos on people? If not already attempted, I might ask her about them. "How did your luncheon photos turn out? Is there a way that I could view them?" I think that would be quite telling.

I guess I never discussed this with her directly, but the church has an online presence where photos of events are posted, and sometimes even has printed out photos to be pinned to a bulletin board. She knows that the church asks for photos people have taken to be shared with others - but she doesn't.

It might be that she has a problem with follow-through.  She likes *taking* the pictures, but actually printing them or posting them could be too much effort for her.  Has anyone actually asked her about it?